Midrange-Reva deck help

[terrarius]

This is my attempt on midrange songhai…diamond 5 right now
Its very messy right now…too many 1 and 2 off i know…since i never played songhai before theres just waaay too much that i want to have in my deck

To explain some choices that may seem strange
-no battle panddo:this guy may be decent in most matchups(but not too good) but its suicide to play this thing vs 6mana vanar…considering vanars popularity it seemed only reasonable to remove him
-ghost lightning:just to deal with luminous discharge…
-2mindkage,1 lantern:just couldnt deceide between the two_:_
-hamon:soo much fun combined with zendo…i want to keep her but if you consider her trash i would remove her…

So what to change?

[phoenixtoasches]

Should really use Kaleos, with midrange you have to stay at a range so as to not get hit but at the same time you should be able to get in close when you need to especially when you play cards like Painter, bandit, and Zendo. I can tell you more, but I think someone else will explain better than me the specifics of your deck. Also there are many guides and threads out there for Songhai midrange, if you can’t find them then ask me.

[reignzu]

I recommend Kaleos if you want a better midrange deck. But if you really like Reva, then these are my opinions :

• Hamon is a bit Risky to play without Kaleos, i like Kaleos+Hamon more because even if enemy body block me and i dont have MDS/juxta, i still have Blink BBS. Blink also really good when you drop big minions like EMp.
• I could safely say remove ghost lightning.
• You must decide to play 3 phoenix fire or 3 fox.
• Also choose 2 lightbender or 2 emp.
• 1 more scroll and Oni if possible.
  Thats all i could think right now.

I usually like Reva more in aggro version than midrange. But doesnt mean Reva midrange is bad. And i think there is a Tier list about Reva Midrange in Bagoum website. You probably should check it out.

Good luck.

[phoenixtoasches]

I dunno about only PF or Fox, I would argue that having both is better for face and get rid of KE entirely since you only have one minion to get its draw from. Otherwise you have big enough minions without KE, but duelyst wouldn’t be very fun if every deck was optimized would it.

[reignzu]

I would prefer Phoenix more than Fox. Not because fox is useless, i feel fox just like Storm kage. Slow, waiting to atk/atked. Where there are a lot better 3 drops choice in Songhai.

Maybe i just have a bad luck, because everytime i drop fox. I got nothing. Lol

But , if @terrarius want to play both, then 1 fox and 1 PF not enough.

[phoenixtoasches]

The only reason why Fox is good in my deck is because I have gotatsu so I get 3 cards max in one turn making fox a pretty good play.

[seraphicreaper]

I think the antithesis of the crux of your whole deck can be identified by Spelljammer. Spelljammer’s good, but for me personally, this seems like a deck where it’s not warranted, and it removing it may help to highlight where the decks’ other awkwardness may lie.

How reliant and often is your spelljammer necessary? You want midrange, but it’s not a low enough curve to need 2 cards per turn does it? Even still, it’s not combo heavy but more development focused. Just picture it out for the moment.

You have Scroll Bandit and Mind-Cage Oni (MCO) (let alone lantern). This seems like sufficient card draw. Why more? For what? Willing to wager you finish most of your games off with a healthy hand size (win or lose).

Healing Mystic is around for what purpose? Usually for you, or for a minion?

What’s your entire decks aim to win? How’s it chip dmg, what’s the win con?

Looks like you just put in a mish-mash of good stand alone cards into a deck. The synergy among your cards is at a pretty low ceiling. It looks like this deck would still get wrecked by any swarm deck.

No intention of being mean/harsh here; more just wanting to pose questions to you for you to reflect on your own deck. I just don’t see any direction here, just good cards.

[nwardezir]

If it may helps refining, @Smash_the_Hamster posted last weeks 3 videos about Control-Hai Reva :

[terrarius]

Wincon?Emp or hamon with zendo are what usualy wins me my games…
Youre right…i have played duelyst long enough to know exactly which cards are strong…i just have huge trouble in making the bigger pictures…in making synergys and a good balance between curve and draw

Is there actually a rule of thumb for cardraw to average manacost?

[eurasianjay]

Omw to work atm so I’ll gladly give feedback later but here is the Midrange Reva list I used to climb to Top 50 S rank last month for those who’d be curious.

[baharoth]

Regarding the amount of draw there is no right or wrong imo. And i don’t know a rule of thump. This is simply something you have to figure out for yourself while playing. At the end of the day the amount of draw you need also depends on the way you play.

I am running 3x Fox 3 x MCO and 2 x Calligrapher in my Midrange Kaleos deck. But King Onyx for example has 2x Fox and 3x MCO and he is fine with it. I tried just 3 of each and found my self out of cards in the late game far too often so i added more.

Your curve is much higher than mine so you probably won’t need that much draw but how much exactly you want to have is something you have to find out via testing. You have to keep in mind though that both fox and MCO aren’t reliable card draw engines since your opponent has to proc them for you to get cards.

[terrarius]

I tryed king onyx midrange deck…didnt win a single game
The reason i choose reva is that im pretty defensive(chasing is always punished in duelyst)…with her BB my enemys MUST chase after me and move into the backstab…with kaleos they camp into the corner all game
With kaleos they cast no spells ,starving me off cards because mindkage and bandit(with fox) are his only draw
With reva they must use spells to get rid of the HS…

Thats why i felt like reva is always better…just take kaleos deck,throw out the flamewings and youre done with the reva version

So what am i missing…whats the kaleos trick?

[phoenixtoasches]

That is not a common situation where the opponent camps or when they don’t use spells. You should be chasing the enemy and use position spells to move your minions closer and closer. If they back away further try to corner them so they can’t summon any minions especially with minions like sunsteel. I actually don’t use bandit in my deck and it’s fine and if anything replace him with flameblood for more face and include gotatsu to proc fox or to damage other minions if you really need the draw. Or you can lower your curve to make the deck more face if you have trouble late game. Also someone upload the guide to Kaleos by Kingonyx since I’m on my phone at the moment. ALSO, I just remembered if you’re plan is to camp out and buff heartseekers you are gonna lose a lot because many factions dispel and most factions are either better at long range than Songhai or will destroy you if you leave them alone for more than one turn. If the opponent stops using spells because of Oni all the better then so their development is stunted while you overwhelm with minions and corner. Although there are some games where the opponent can go pretty well without spells the trick is to not wait in a corner expecting them to cast a spelll any day now so they can just develop board, instead attack while they are disabled.

[terrarius]

I replaced
3 sunsteel for 3 thunderhorn
3 flame wreath for 3 killing edges
kaleos with reva,

From barely winning in diamond5 im now d4 with a decent wr…just by removing the kaleos parts of the deck…realy must be doing something terrible wrong with kaleos

[phoenixtoasches]

Maybe you are right about Reva being better. If you ever get the time maybe you can share some replays of you playing with the Kaleos deck?

[terrarius]

I added you within duelyst…you can check whichever replay you want
You can see when i switched decks by the massive change in terms of winrate

[phoenixtoasches]

Okay, maybe you’re right, but just to prove how much I believe in Kaleos, let’s have a 'lil competition on a set date. We each play with our respective decks and see who wins more. I’m at a lower rank right now so let’s wait until I catch up and then we brawl it out (not against each other though, just win-rates). Who ever wins gets a spirit orb from the other or 100 gold, but someone has tell me how that would work. ALSO, if this seems enticing to anybody reading this right now, you can sign up and and put a spirit orb in the pool, but you can only play a version of mid-range Songhai, no other factions and no spellhai and you have to be at least diamond. Does this sound good to you @terrarius?

Formal invitations to @nwardezir, @longshot405, @isbee, @seraphicreaper, @eurasianjay and @turtlesquirtleman to participate and other frequent posters that I can’t remember right now. Although I have no idea how the hell this is gonna work if we get this started

[seraphicreaper]

How would one give a spirit orb to another? Additionally, the skill of us individually may not be proper representation of the deck quality itself. I’ve never gotten to diamond (nor do I think many of my decks are diamond worthy, but I like de meh-mehs)

Does still sound fun in some manner though.

Edit: @phoenixtoasches additionally, shouldn’t we be attempting to present a mid-range deck? I mean, I already got an aggro songhai deck I love

[phoenixtoasches]

Yeah, that’s what I’m having trouble with. I was thinking we could all give someone trustworthy the reward pile and someone who has their own referral code and that person would then give whoever wins the rewards, but someone more experienced then me has to look into that. I do think everyone should go to Diamond before participating so that there is skill level and card collection bar, but if your concern is that you don’t want to go to Diamond just yet the competition will be near the end of October so you can wait to climb the ladder until season is almost done with random meme decks.

EDIT: Nah, if there are real rewards involved then I want to make this more than just theorycrafting decks and the reason why I am making it midrange is because I want to determine the best version. Maybe you can use your aggro deck, but you have to post it so we can see if it is not some kind of spellhai variant. Everybody else try not to post your deck lists until end of competition so that you can’t tech for specific cards or strategies.

[phoenixtoasches]

I should also mention that since we can’t tell if you are using a midrange Songhai deck during the competition the only people who can enter are frequent posters so there is a strong code of honor. It will stay this way unless there is a way to check someone’s deck list from a match.

EDIT: Maybe we can use battlefly or something to make this tournament instead so more people can enter?