Lyonar-,,meta,, in need of evolution?


This is kinda personal…so dont take it too serious.Just my thoughts.

After over 900 lyonar victorys i thought that it may be a good idea to test out other factions myself …cant realy return to lyonar as mainfaction now…still fun from time to time but too simple to keep maining
They just feel so 1dimensional after having experienced the more complicated gameplay of other factions by playing those(ofcource with some exceptions…but those exceptions are not entire factions/generals but only certain archetypes).
Only zir,an has in my opinion nice combos ,minion-synergy and gameplay that is alright in terms of complexity…but shes too weak to be counted here(camp in a corner and let her be at 25hp unless she engages first and shes finished because lyonar has no lategame)
They have such potential…the slow yet powerfull empire,strongest near its allys and master of defense.Makes little sense than that their best decks are very aggresive…they would be ,in my opinion,much more fun as a defensive faction that lets the enemys come to them.
One idea to make that work :siege minions.These minions
-are extremely op relative to their manacost
-cannot be targeted by your spells(no aegis!)
-only have their effects nearby your general
-die immidiately if not on your half of the field
-get a massive additional effect if positioned on hallowed ground

To be relevant as a defensive lategame-focused faction lyonar would ofcource also need a real wincon OR powerfull transform removal…although that has to be carefully made. It should ofcource be situational…we dont want aggro argeon with effective transform-removal.

Im currently playing midrange songhai…strange that the supposed aggro-/outofhandburst -faction seems to perform better as a controlish-faction than lyonar

Whats your thought about lyonars current state?
This is not about powerlevel…the aggresive argeon decks are still doing alright.


Wait, so are you complaining about the lack of power in Lyonar (control variants in particular) or are you complaining about the lack in deck diversity?

If it’s about power level (in regards to control) I think Lyonar got hit pretty hard. Don’t get me wrong, all factions are doing pretty well for themselves in this stage of the game, but Lyonar has to tech some really specific cards to counter what’s out there.

If you’re talking about lack of diversity then the issue lies in competition. Someone once said that in a CCG, not every card can be equal in terms of power and that those non powerful cards can be used to fill in a specific niche to enhance game diversity. Once you stop trying to be competitive then you find yourself in a whole other world of possibilities. It’s actually pretty neat.

Anyways, once you decide on whether your issue lies in diversity or power hit me up will ya?

And then I can decide whether or not to give your post a like


I already said that the overall powerlevel of lyonar is not the issue
The issue to me is that all of that power lies within very simple,similar and aggresive decks


Lyonar is definitely one of the most straight-forward factions. Even the Alabaster Titan archetype doesn’t seem too different from standard tempo lists, just a more clear win con and the obvious lack of a few key spells.

My fear for pushing Lyonar to a lategame faction is that in order to do so, you need strong removal, and Lyonar’s removal is definitely not the greatest. This worries me because IF Lyonar got stronger removal, they would also have the heavily-statted minions to pair with that removal.

Lyonar is never too far from the top of the tier list, and that’s because it’s hard to go wrong with minions that have large stats. More removal could push Lyonar to a level I don’t want to imagine.

If the faction is going to see change, I hope it’s in the form of a keyword ability. Zeal seems so boring. Gaining a few stats when close to your general? I’m not amused if I’m being honest. As of now though, healing decks are the only ones I can see as lategame decks.


Just gonna put it out there that you never mentioned control Lyonar being too weak. You just said,


I think that Lyonar’s fast, aggressive decks will always be powerful since the minions are good and their win-cons come on earlier than their opponent can prevent.

Control Lyonar is still powerful, but you can’t just do the whole divine bond ironcliffe as reliably anymore. Changes to how we play things due to the new cards just make that play too risky and too rare to cater to. Rather, you’re given stuff like excelsious, peacekeeper, and other things to use lategame. Just alter the way you play control Lyonar and I’m sure that you can find some viable fun there.

Anyways, hope this helps


I have been seeing quite a few Lyonar decks that have been peaking my interest:

  1. There’s the standard boring tempo one that’s been around since last year. Nothing much to say about this one

  2. Healing Lyonar has been doing fairly well with the introduction of Hallowed Ground. Now, it’s way easier to trigger heal synergies

  3. Alabaster titian is a pretty fun deck that actually got me to play Argeon. The problem is that I can see this turning solely into a shell for Mech decks, and the less Mech decks the better. Also, this deck looses HARD against EMP

  4. I have ran into a few hyperagressive swarm / Golem Argeon that bumrush you with 1 mana minions and play Empyreal Congregate or Warblade. A lot of luck-of-the -draw involved with this deck, seeing how a good opening can decide the game.

  5. I have seen a few of the tournament regulars running heaviely teched control Lyonars. They’re probably preparing a deck for a tournament, since decks like that will probably be too clunky for ladder.

Out of all of these, the only decks I enjoy playing are the Titan and Healing Varients. I find Titan to be radically different than generic Tempo Lyonar, since you are usually playing from behind until Titan stabilizes the game. However, I fear that Lyonar might carry the cross of being the “Mech faction” due to Mech Titan decks.


Have you ever tried something along the lines of this?

Yes, Lyonar doesn’t have flashy killer combos but their ability to dominate the board, even in the lategame is nothing to scoff at. You definetely don’t have to play them aggressively. The fact that they are rather simple and straight forward is probably intended, they are the beginner faction after all. Making them more complicated would kill that purpose.

I can get why you feel like Lyonar should be a more defensive faction but i think pushing them into that direction now would cause serious problems. They already have all the aggro tools along with probably the best card draw and the most effecient healing in the game. Do you really want to give them top notch removal and late game killer combos to supplement their arsenal? They would make Vanar control decks look fun and interactive if they ever got that.


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