Ideas on supporting Sajj outside of NOSE


#1

Bringing those out of Deathsadvocate’s thread, just to place them in a more visible place to discuss. For as much as we love to scream on Sajj being weak i mostly feel she’s poorly supported - the general condition of her is of a general that has a theme much akin Ilena, where you’re one of the best ‘remove with face’ generals of your faction but hindered by a certain trait. In this case, Sajj lacks stable safety tools.
While her Vanar counterpart can easily recycle the tons of stuns into perfect clean removal with no counter to her face, Sajj struggles a bit in keeping her faceplate intact. Many of the proposals below are geared around protecting her, while a few others are a bit more esoteric in the sense they’re spun around some slight sabotage/revival play she can take with the vetruvian artifacts. I’m on the run as i post this, but soon i’ll be expanding on better reasonings on each change - i’ll drop them here mostly to get questions warmed up and explain, as well rethink ideas with your suggestions.

Card by Card
Artifact Hunter

Cost down to 3. Stats down to 2/3
Cheaper usage as tutoring.

Atom Klinger

Whenever you General equips an Artifact, give this minion +2 Attack. Reduce the first damage your General takes each turn by half this value.

Corpse Combustion

4 Mana. Summon a random friendly minion with Dying Wish that was destroyed this game.

While it might be weird to place this in ArtifSajj, i generally feel revival decks are the best space for Vetruvian Relic decks, so here we go.

Falcius

3 Mana. Give your General +1 Attack and they take no damage this turn.

Grincher

OG: Equip a random Artifact from your faction.

Grove Lion

5 mana. While this minion is in the battlefield, the first time your General takes damage each turn, reduce it by 2.

Imperial Mechanyst

At the end of your turn, repair all of your Artifacts by 1 durability.

Incinera

4 mana, stats down to 4/5

Matter Shaper

Stats down to 3/3.
OG: Forge a nearby enemy minion with up to 2 Attack into a Relic of its faction.

Mirage Master

OG: Summon a copy of an enemy minion.

Part relic, part sabotage, equal parts fun.

Oserix

Stats down to 5/5. No longer flies.
OG AND DW: Equip a random artifact from your deck.

Wind Striker

Now has Taunt instead of Flying.


#2

Wouldnt windstriker be nerfed?I don,t play sajj but isn,t windstriker+neuro a key combo to get your trial off?


#3

As said, OUTSIDE of NOSE decks. I see them so filled with other fliers that might as well just neurolol whichever crazy cheap birb you have in hand.


#4

Half this value? So… 1?

OP. Honestly, Falcius is still good now, people just wrote him off without reason after the nerf. This suggestion would be fair if Falcius had 2 health as well.

Way to ruin the fun. It should be from any faction.

Too complicated when it could just give Forcefield, as it does now. Why not just make it a 5 mana 4/5?

I like it!

I have a feeling that Mirage Master is actually really good, but no one has bothered to try him in a competitive deck.

We don’t need more minions with wings that can’t fly…


#5

The reason mirage master sucks…
There are no good targets in the current meta
If there are targets you likely sacrifice your whole turn to copy that dangerous minion…your opponent now can act with his own while having his whole turn to answer your copy


#6
  1. For each time you buff it.

The Falcius thing is complicated as i’m also pegging down its damage, so it felt me fair. Perhaps you’re right on the 2 HP.

5 mana 5/4 i’d say for Lion, and good thing to know Regalia is complex.

And those are hands, not wings.


#7

Ooooops. Thinking of Wind Shrike. :wink:


#8

I’ve played quite a bit of Spinecleaver Sajj, so here’s some things that I would like to see our favourite robot get. Even one or two of these changes may push Sajj control out of obscurity. I particularly want the Spinecleaver, Incenera, Osirix, and Droplift changes. Finally, I made a Sajj BBS change that I think it should have been all along.

Scioness Sajj

BBS: Your General deals double damage to minions until the start of your next turn.

Explaination: This makes Sajj’s BBS useful defensively on your opponent’s turn. In a meta with Khunaam Kha, and Rupper Combo, this can be very useful (you can use it to kill buffed rippers, but also not use it to prevent Ka-Ka lethal.)

Windslicer

2 mana 2/2
Opening Gambit: If you have an artifact equipped, draw 2 cards.

Explaination: Most of Vetruvian’s draw lies in the golem package. This minion allows Vetruvian to have the same sort of high draw earlygame but with cheap artifacts instead. Early artifacts are generally weaker than golems, but it does give Sajj some nice earlygame. (

Osirix

7 mana, 7/5
Flying Opening Gambit: Summon all enemies minions destroyed by your general this game.

Explaination: A lot of Vetruvian’s artifacts follow the “killing stuff matters” theme. Furthermore, Sajj’s BBS allows her to kill things more easiely. So, I want to expand on the “killing stuff” theme that Sajj currently has, as well as give Sajj a board-based endgame card.

Imperial Mechanist

3 mana, 2/5
Opening Gambit Transform your artifacts into random Vetruvian artifacts that cost 1 more.

Explaination This can be a double edged sword (pun intended), since you may loose your valuable Wildfire Ankhs. Very powerful effect, but you need artifacts to use it.

Incenera

4 mana 4/5
Your general may more 2 extra spaces.

Explaination: This might make this minion too strong. A 4/5 with instant defensive or removal impact, and value over time potential is very very scary. If Incenera was changed this way, It might be good enough for Zirix or Cypheron. However, it would still be competing with the extremely powerful Allomancer.

Obdurater

6 mana artifact
+3 attack, Forcefield Whenever your general deals damage, restore that much health.

Explaination: This is a very strong Artifact. If your opponent has no pings, you will restore a lot of health before this breaks. However, Vetruvian’s artifacts (outside of Anhk) have been so weak for so long, that they are long overdue for a strong beat stick.

Thunderclap

3 mana
Whenever your general destroys a minion, summon a copy of it nearby.

Explaination: This makes it on par with Mind Lathe. While Lathe is good on high health minions, Sacrifice spells, and can lead to surprises Lethals, This synergizes with Sajj’ BBS, and all of Vet’s ways to kill things easier.

Droplift

(Change name to “Astral Strike”)
1 mana
Your general makes a ranged attack to target minion.

Explaination: Right now, this card is little more than a meme. With this change, you get a Vetruvian equalvalent to Lava Lance that also has artifact/kill stuff synergy.

Zephyr

3 mana, 3/4
Bloodsurge: Your General gains Frenzy on your next attack

Explaination: a nice little buff to put this minion up to speed with other Bloodsurge minions.

Spinecleaver

5 mana
+1 attack. Whenever your general destroys an enemy minion, summon a bloodfire totem that steals life.

Explaination: Gives Spinecleaver more survivability. Now, bloodfire totems are much more valuable. This also gives Vetruvian a reliable source of healing.


#9

I particularly like the Sajj change itself as it reflects the general direction i dream her defenses to go: indirect protection, since you force people to rethink the very act of rushing against her. Not much a fan of the healing effects, but that’s mostly me going “Vetruvian shouldn’t have (general) healing”. I’d be up to discuss ways to make Spinecleaver and maybe Obdurator into a source of hardiness but without direct heals - likely a bigger focus on damage/attack reduction.

Among the reworks you threw there, the Windslicer strikes me odd a little but that likely comes from me being a satisfied lunatic running both Burden and Foundry - also as it competes with Pax and Dusk Weaver as cards i like to recycle with Reliquarian. Reworked Droplift straight up scares me.

On other stuff unspoken, i guess making so Hexblade doesn’t raise Attack of minions with no damage also would be a small but wondrous fix.


#10

How about “Your General may move one more space for each equipped artifact?” Zirix never uses Incinera so I don’t give a damn.


#11

A review idea that came to mind right now on Bloodfire Totems:

1- now they’re friendly units instead of being summoned for your opponent;
2- their new effect is “whenever an enemy unit attacks or counterattacks your General, deal them 1 damage and give them -1 Attack until their next turn”.

The first aspect is just to ensure playaround the potentially grotesque defensive power of this new version, but imagine. Every enemy down is one more “can you please not?” for Sajj, making her slowly hardier and hardier to punish and more punishing in her advances if you don’t destroy her added pylons.


#12

A long time ago i suggested this change for sajj bbs: “your general takes no damage from minions this turn”. I still believe that this would fix sajj playability on his own, giving her built in artifact protection and moving her current bbs to a minion.


#13

The problem here is that this pretty much overlaps with Ciphy.


#14

Ciphy use his bbs for favorable trade and more importantly for sabotage stuff. Their play style would still be different


#15

Questionable. While niches are already different, he already uses it to outshine Sajj in her own niche. This similarity still may lead into ‘just shift into whichever of the two does it best’ instead of actual identities, depending on what strategy is currently better. Moving her BBS to a minion risks it even further as it allows any general to take her niche of ultimate minion destroyer.


#16

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