Duelyst Chess, a different kind of Duelyst match


#21

Yeah, but it’s fighting a copy of the same deck so the power level shouldn’t matter too much.


#22

I like the idea, but how about you add in the condition of no moving (forward) until you fill up your starting column?


#23

Guys the idea isn’t to make the game play like chess, but to take the idea of chess - heavy emphasis on positioning, unique tools, fair matchup - and bring that to Duelyst. This doesn’t mean having 2 of each card, or looking for something to replace pawns, this means having Provoke units and no out of hand damage and limited removal tools.

I was thinking about adding Flyers, I think the 1 mana 2/1 would be great for when you have time to develop and use it for removal next turn. I think Dust Wailer is great as an expensive removal tool and useful body. I cut Hulk because if you don’t have removal it becomes extremely powerful when played early, and didn’t feel super fair when played against you. I like it for this list but cut it as opposed to cutting other things.

I really think cutting the deck to all 3ofs would bring about the consistency we want, but I like only having 2 of each card and I don’t want to cut anything else (and I really want Chirpuka back…) so I guess we’ll mess with it.


#24

positioning becomes a really big issue then, doesn’t it?


#25

You’d play the 2/5 that moves an additional space if you wanted real chess :thinking:


#26

exactly


#27

Thats already mentioned above, friend. Read the thread :slight_smile:


#28

i tried making an abyssian list based on these, but it felt so unfair that the deck was so strong. i mean budget lilithe is ladder viable and doesnt really rely on out of hand damage, healing, or removal anyway. just swarm and smash face. and without the aoe that reks the dek its basically unopposed.

i feel like tempo lyonar would literally just remove the holy immo and triinity oath and literally nothing else would change


#29

Alright, folks, appreciate the input, keep it coming. Like @whyb0t said, the goal isn’t really to emulate chess. I want, boiling it down, a game of Duelyst that isn’t based on instant value. Duelyst as it’s actually played is mostly about instant value. I mean, look at the worldcore golem, the swarmking scarab, Grandmaster Nosh-Rak, Grandmaster Kraigon. They all look godlike on paper, but they generally don’t get played because they don’t generate instant value. Look at all the cards considered staples. Virtually all of them generate a lot of instant value.

So what I’m really getting at here is Duelyst with a lot less instant value, and also with fairly little infinite value, which is why kolossus didn’t make it in even though grimrock did. Because without absolute removal, one of the most common types of instant value card, infinite value cards would be the next thing to take the game over. I mean, of the two games I played with Whybot, I won one because of a huge grimrock, and threatened to win the other with…a less-huge-but-big-enough-to-get-the-job-done grimrock.

Moving on from that…@fr0stfyre1, I’d be willing to try your Chess with Sajj, although I’m somewhat worried that ranged and blast will prove too powerful. I guess testing would be in order. I also feel that only including basics is too limiting to your design space.

Oh, and I checked, and analogical is a word. It means having to do with an analogy or analogies. While we’re at it, vomitous and cinderous are also words. Nothing to do with anything, I just like them. (I’m a cool and edgy hipster because I started saying those words before checking to see if they were in the dictionary. In unrelated news, there’s a vile and untrue rumor I’m an ego-stroking wordophile.)

What does everyone think of the mentioned idea of making a list of Fair Duelyst cards that can be used to build decks as you see fit, rather than a single specific list to be played against itself?

Also, new iteration of Chess with Starhorn in the topic header very shortly after this post hits, everyone check it out.

One last thing, I highly encourage everyone to try playing this or something very like this with your friends, the others on the forum, me, anyone you can get to put up with it. I’d love more feedback on what people’s play experiences are.


#30

I made a weird ass curve based tempo vet list, without the removal and without Aymara it should be fair.


#31

If you want to post a Duelyst Chess variant of it, I’ll be happy to play you. I’m not doing anything else at the moment.


#32

As you can see it was a bit old.

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#33

Alright, I tried to build something that retained some of the cards in the original. I got something really…provoking. I feel like this one came out pretty weird. I don’t have silvertongue corsairs and I just got done disenchanting a bunch of legendaries I probably wasn’t going to use anyway to make vindicators, so I don’t want to cough up the three hundred spirit for them right now. I also put in a lot of card advantage, since this isn’t going to be the absolute cardfest that is Starhorn versus Starhorn, which I think is why I picked Starhorn in the first place, so I didn’t have to put draw in.

A ton of provoke, some flying, and a bunch of soft removal options. Feels a lot messier than the Starhorn deck. Might be fun, won’t know until we try.


#34

Dang it. Onoreeeeeee


#35

How do you think this would play out? i think it’d be very fun.

especially bluetip scorpion or serpenti can be very fun in an positioning based battle like this.


#36

hmmm… that might actually be very interesting, though I really don’t find recombobulus and aer pridebeak useful in the deck. Since you’ve essentially got no buffs at all, I would deem it safe to run a few copies of pyromancer to replace pridebeak, and a few copies of bloodtear alchemist as a counter. Looks especially fun with ciphyron


#37

then it boils down to who opens pyromancer and can you draw alchemist in time. pyro is to dominating without removal i think. also in a game like this there will be a lot of kiting around attack ranges to prevent bad trades (think fire emblem) and recombobulus can cleverly move that serpenti into the enemy lines for a big frenzy.
aer can be replaced tho yes. what do you think about komodo hunter?

EDIT: also recombobulus to move a bluetip scorpion to remove a hailstone golem must feel godlike xD


#38

komodo hunter is a little iffy to be honest. It’s balanced when removal exists.Same with quahog. But when you don’t even have soft removal like sandswirl reader, it might be a little too powerful, especially since it can’t be removed, and two komodo chargers are definitely not worth it. Recombobulus does teleport randomly doesn’t it? I mean the RNG is probably very unhelpful. Imagine a quahog smacking you face because of bob. Pyro won’t dominate I feel, as a measly two attack can’t help very much, especially if you have a komodo hunter going face. If you do feel like that, how about vale hunter? A slight ping is about as good as a card like bloodtear. Though if that is the case, you will want to include a couple of first wishes for card power and some fun. Actually I might feel like trying a slightly legendary oriented edition of this deck… How about this?


#39

@raputha, @fr0stfyre1, after looking over your work, I came up with this.

It’s a mix of ideas from the two of you, my own attempt at Vetruvian from earlier, and my main Starhorn deck.

Related note, the Starhorn deck has been updated, now with no pushdogs. Check the bottom of the topic header.


#40

I just got an revolutionary idea…why not just play real chess?