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Decklist - Midrange Shadow Nova

Thought I’d get the Abyssian discussion going by sharing a Shadow Nova list I’ve been working on.

The picture might look a little weird due to formatting, click on it to display the list properly.

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1 Cassyva Soulreaper
3 Bloodtear Alchemist
3 Grasp of Agony
3 Daemonic Lure
3 Healing Mystic
3 Primus Fist
3 Spectral Blade
3 Alcuin Loremaster
3 Sojourner
3 Dioltas
3 Shadow Sister Kelaino
3 Sunset Paragon
3 Shadow Nova
3 Spectral Revenant

###Intro

This particular list is a variant of the common Shadow Nova list that aims to stop the momentum of the aggressive decks and then deal enough damage so that any aggressive deck will not be able to win before you do. At the same time, the deck contains just enough removal and minions to comfortably combat slower decks, and then finish them off with damage from your 7-cost cards.

Consistency is key in this list, which is a major reason why there are 3 copies of every card. There are cards which serve crucial roles in some matchups which you must draw or replace into during the game.

###Gameplan

The goal of the deck is a rather simple one, stay ahead of your opponent on the board, deal damage, and finish with Shadow Nova and Spectral Revenant. To break it down a little more:

  1. Mulligan for 1 and 2-cost minions

  2. Attempt to spend all you mana in playing out your cards; keep your minions close to the mana Springs if your opponent is on the other side of the board and move your minions onto the mana Springs if your opponent is near them.

  3. Use Daemonic Lure, Grasp of Agony, and Sunset Paragon to control enemy minions by keeping them toward the center of the board. Allowing a minion with a powerful effect to stay on a tile you cannot reach is one of the main two ways you can lose.

  4. Keep your minions in play as long as you can. Minions are the best way to combat your opponent’s cards, since with help from the aforementioned spells they are are able to trade with multiple cards. You may attack the enemy general with them if they survive, but always leave several minions alive to be able to reach as large of a section of the board as possible.

  5. If your opponent plays something threatening you have no chance of answering, start attacking their general. Get as much damage in as possible and hope that you can delay the game long enough for your finishers to do their work.

  6. About 2 turns before you reach 7 mana, begin keeping your 7-cost cards in hand. If you have one of them to play on your 7 mana turn, your chances of winning the game go up significantly. If you are playing a slow deck, you can keep these cards on even earlier turns.

  7. On your 7 mana turn, your hope is to draw and play one of these 7 mana cards. If you’re behind at this point, you may use them as removal, however if your opponent is low on health, it may be better to deal damage to their general in an attempt to end the game within a turn or two.

  8. Replace every turn to try to reach your 7-cost finishers. A second one usually seals the game in your favor, but you might need to survive a few turns first. Here is where you often start running out of cards too, so position your board very carefully and avoid having your minions die without at least taking another minion down with them.

###Mulligans and Initial Plays

####Going First:

Look for any 1 or 2-cost minion.

Toss away all 7-cost cards first, then toss away Sunset Paragon and Alcuin Loremaster. These are cards you could use to great effect later in the game but are near worthless.

Keep Grasp of Agony when facing a known aggressive deck.

Spectral Blade and Daemonic Lure are alright to keep as long as you have several low-cost minions in hand; they provide you with varied options depending on what your opponent plays.

Going first, always move your general two spaces to the right. Even if you don’t have a minion to play, this puts you in a position to walk to a Mana Spring and play a minion on top of it. If you have a 1 or 2-cost minion in hand, always play it diagonally right to place it in position to move onto a Mana Spring.

Which minion to play? (items mentioned first are stronger plays)

  1. If you happen to have two Bloodtear Alchemists in your opening hand, play one diagonally right down and one diagonally right up after moving your general two spaces to the right.

  2. Play Healing Mystic diagonally as mentioned.

  3. Play Primus Fist diagonally as mentioned.

  4. Play Bloodtear Alchemist diagonally as mentioned, dealing 1 to the enemy general.

  5. Equip Spectral Blade.

  6. Replace a card you cannot play and pass your turn after walking two steps right.

From here, your next turn depends greatly on which cards you have in hand and what your opponent plays. Some of the possible plays include:

  • Walk your minion (played on turn 1) onto a Mana Spring, play either two 2-drops or a 4-drop.

  • Walk your minion onto Mana Spring, walk your general diagonally to the other spring, play a 3-cost minion on top of it, then play a 2-drop.

  • Walk your minion onto Mana Spring, use Spectral Blade or Daemonic Lure to help kill an opposing minion, play a 2-drop diagonally to prevent your opponent from taking the other spring.

  • Play Grasp of Agony on one of the opponent’s minions to destroy them all and then play a 2-drop.

Keep the gameplan in mind, and continue to build your advantage on the board if you have it.

####Going Second:

Look for a combination of a 1 and 3 cost card or two 2-cost cards with one being a minion.

Toss away all 7-cost cards first, then toss away Sunset Paragon.

Keep Grasp of Agony when facing a known aggressive deck.

Keep Daemonic Lure and Spectral Blade if you have another 2 or 1-cost minion already in hand.

If you have no other 1 or 2-cost minions in hand, keep Alcuin Loremaster.

Just like when going first, you must walk 2 tiles left toward the center of the board. From here, attempt to play a minion in the center of the board by first playing one on the nearby mana tile. This puts your second minion in a good position to take either of the remaining Springs and there are few cards that hurt you for playing your first turn in this way.

  1. You’ll need two minions for this. Play the one that is most easily destroyed on the spring and the one that is more difficult to kill in the center.

  2. If you are not able to play two minions, play one on the nearby mana tile. The only time you should play a minion next to the Mana Spring without taking it is when your opponent had no minion to play on their first turn.

  3. If your opponent has played a minion with 3 health, you could Daemonic Lure it to your general’s location and destroy it, denying your opponent the easy Mana Spring. Do so after walking two steps left and playing a minion on the Mana Spring if possible.

  4. Follow a minion dropped onto a Spring with equipping Spectral Blade to prevent your opponent from playing minions too close to the center.

  5. If you don’t have any cards to play, try to replace into something you can play next turn.

The second turn for player 2 depends a lot on any cards played by player one. Follow the gameplan and maintain the board.

###Tips and Suggestions

  • Play Grasp of Agony on the turn you can use its effect, just because you have the mana to play the card doesn’t mean it should be played.

  • Daemonic Lure isn’t just for swinging Minions into Shadow Creep. Use it early game to throw a valuable enemy minion into the fray or to toss a large enemy minion into the corner to not deal with it.

  • Remember to attack with your general last if you have a spectral blade equipped.

  • Bloodborne Spells are spells, and can be recovered by Alcuin Loremaster. Yours is one of the strongest and is often worth recovering even if you can’t use it the same turn.

  • Keep the card history bar open to see which spell was played last. You do not want to get a Bloodborne spell by accident if you don’t need it.

  • You don’t need the effects of your minions to activate to play them. Sometimes it’s important to just have a minion on the board.

  • Sojourner draws only when dealing damage, not taking it.

  • Play Shadow Sister far away from enemy units, just like you would Shadowdancer, a stray Zen’rui Opening Gambit on her will usually lose you the game.

  • Remember that Sunset Paragon damages your minions too.

  • Playing Sunset Paragon next to Sojourner causes it to deal damage to itself and draw you a card.

  • If possible, do not leave a tile between the Shadow Creep made by Shadow Nova and the edges of the board. This allows your opponent to stand near the wall and make your next Shadow Nova less effective.

###Possible Substitutions:

Primus Shieldmaster can work in place of Dioltas when facing a lot more dispel, since it’s more likely to stay on the board.

Reaper of the Nine Moons can be added to better combat decks with large minions such as Lyonar’s Ironcliffe Guardian or Magmar’s Silithar Elder. The minion is good on its own in many situations as well.

More card draw can be added to the deck through Rite of the Undervault, though a bit on the expensive side. Symmetrical card draw can be used to great effect when facing slower decks, but actively hurts you when facing aggressive decks.


Comments, suggestions, and questions are always welcome!

2 Likes

Hi dude

Your list looks over simplistic IMO and lack a few pieces as well as a lot of building mistakes.

3 Abyssal Crawler

Abyssal crawler is decent if you also play darkspine elemental and that case you might consider playing abyssal juggernaut as well , otherwise the card is pretty bad.

3 Grasp of Agony

The card is good but very situational you don’t want 3 of them also you need bloodtear alchemist to synergize with it in early game.

3 Alcuin Loremaster

Seems very underwhelming in your deck

3 Breath of the Unborn

The actual state of the meta doesn’t justify that many aoe especially when you are already playing 3 grasp,on top of that breath is pretty bad.

3 Spectral Revenant

Probably too many in a deck that is already playing 3 shadow nova.

Overall your deck has too many answers and not enough pro active cards , the pro active cards you are missing are reaper of the nine moon and/or vorpal reaver , also shadow sister is an auto inclusion in any abyssian control deck since it is almost an auto win vs aggro and great against anything else, the only reason I would consider not running it would be if the meta was infested by zen’rui but that is no really the case right now.

Finally I think that thanks to the replace mechanic Duelyt is a game that encourage you to play a lot of 2 of and 1 of, especially in a deck that is planning to make the game very long.

The only cards you want to play in 3 exemplars are:
-Card that are a core part of your strategy ( shadow nova)
-Cards that you want in your opening hand (2 drops)
-Cards that are too good to not be 3 of (IMO: shadow sister, dioltas, demonic lure)

Hope I helped

1 Like

Thank you for your suggestions, I’m always looking for ways to adjust the list.

First of all, I will definitely be playing Shadow Sister to try out how she works currently. When I tested her out on the Sister’s release, she got Zen’rui-d almost every other game. I’ve definitely noticed less Zen-rui played so it’s probably worth a shot. Dioltas I’ll test again as well in place of Shieldmaster. Deamonic Lure is already a 3-of in the deck, so looks like I’m good there.

Abyssal Crawler is actually a remnant from a time when I did run Darkspine, but as it’s not in the list, Bloodtear Alchemist is the replacement.

The deck is designed to win completely against aggressive low-minion decks, so Breath and Grasp are 3-of with the potential for more by recycling those cards with Alcuin.

Grasp of Agony and Alcuin Loremaster come as a pair, where you could deal a lot of damage to groups of minions from Kara, Lilithe, and the Lyonar generals. Alcuin also recycles your Bloodborne Spell and Deamonic Lure, which is crucial for affecting a far tile on the board.

I’m very much unsure about Vorpal Reaver, you do sometimes need a turn 6 play, but often it is spent preparing for the tempo loss to your Shadow Nova next turn. I guess Reaver does that admirably, but there really is only one optimal turn you can play it, after which you’d rather be playing your 7 drops, which you can draw two-of consistently because you have 3-of each.

Finally I think that thanks to the replace mechanic Duelyt is a game that encourage you to play a lot of 2 of and 1 of, especially in a deck that is planning to make the game very long.

This was definitely the case before 0.61, but now I’m not so sure. The replace mechanic does add a ton of consistency to your gameplan, but I don’t think any single copy of a card really should be played when you have 39 cards total and draw one. 2-of is probably completely fine for tech cards and cards you don’t want to draw until late-lategame. I did experiment with 2 Breath of the Unborn for some time, but the single copy of the final card I’ve added was pretty much never drawn for it to be useful.

Thank you for your advice, anything helps in refining the deck, even if it will only exist for a little bit longer.

First of all, I will definitely be playing Shadow Sister to try out how she works currently. When I tested her out on the Sister’s release, she got Zen’rui-d almost every other game. I’ve definitely noticed less Zen-rui played so it’s probably worth a shot.

At the beginning of the season that was understandable, but now Zen’rui sees a lot less play (from my experience in S-rank/diamond). The problem is that with your 3 sojourners your list kinda get blown out by zen’rui anyway.

Abyssal Crawler is actually a remnant from a time when I did run Darkspine, but as it’s not in the list, Bloodtear Alchemist is the replacement.

Sounds much better to have alchemist over darkspine in this list it will make grasp much better, anyway if you post a topic about a deck the minimum is to put an updated list.

Grasp of Agony and Alcuin Loremaster come as a pair,

Alcuin a grasp is not very good since you rarely need more than one grasp per game.

The deck is designed to win completely against aggressive low-minion decks, so Breath and Grasp are 3-of with the potential for more by recycling those cards with Alcuin.

The only decks that suffer from breath is abyss swarm and vanar wall , they represent a very very small portion of the meta so it is definitely not worth it to have that much AOE

I’m very much unsure about Vorpal Reaver, you do sometimes need a turn 6 play, but often it is spent preparing for the tempo loss to your Shadow Nova next turn. I guess Reaver does that admirably, but there really is only one optimal turn you can play it, after which you’d rather be playing your 7 drops, which you can draw two-of consistently because you have 3-of each.

In Duelsyt , every turn you always have the choice to play a threat or answer an opponent threat ,if you can’t deal with it or this threat is not important enough to be worth dealing with, you can just develop your own which is a good play in a lot of cases. By playing to few pro active card you are basically dismissing one of those options which will result into being screwed if:
-You don’t the right answer against the opponent threat
-There is no threat to answer

If you play like 2 reaper 2 reaver 3 shadow nova 2 reveneant

Your average curve patern is turn 4 reaper turn 5 reaver , turn 6 shadow nova/revenant turn 7 shadow nova/revenant

Currently you have: 6 7 drops and a bunch of situational answer

So your average curve patern is completely messed up and rely exclusively on the fact that you have the right answer at the right time.

This was definitely the case before 0.61, but now I’m not so sure. The replace mechanic does add a ton of consistency to your gameplan,

In magic we play a lot of 1 of 2 of and 3 of (maximum being 4) in 60 cards deck with no replace ! Even in deck without tutor and cantrip.

but I don’t think any single copy of a card really should be played when you have 39 cards total and draw one.

You are wrong :slight_smile:

Thank you for your advice, anything helps in refining the deck, even if it will only exist for a little bit longer.

Your welcome, a lot of what I said can be applied in every deck don’t worry.

1 Like

If you post a topic about a deck the minimum is to put an updated list

Now updated! I’ve tested out some of your suggestions and have substituted in both Dioltas and Kelaino, which do improve the deck’s quality.

now Zen’rui sees a lot less play

Sadly seems just as you are saying that, there are now decklists of Cassyva with Zen’rui at 2-3 copies. We’ll see if that continues, as during testing Zen’rui on Kelaino the one time it happened was a blowout win for my opponent.

The only decks that suffer from breath is abyss swarm and vanar wall , they represent a very very small portion of the meta so it is definitely not worth it to have that much AOE.

Tested this and though those matchups are made more difficult, along with Kara decks, Breath isn’t particularly necessary; removed it to make room for Kelaino.

Alcuin a grasp is not very good since you rarely need more than one grasp per game.

Not the only thing it’s used for. Alcuin also is very useful at recycling Lure, Abyssal Scar, and the very rare Shadow Nova. It also makes my opponent a lot more weary to use their spells on a non-bloodborne turn once they see the first copy. It acts as a Phoenix Fire with a card draw the vast majority of the time which is something that this specific deck really likes. I’ve won a fair amount of games due to my opponent helping me out by playing their own minion-buffing spells as well, though that can’t be considered a reliable upside. I maintain that Alcuin has its use in the deck and deserves 2 if not 3 copies in the deck.

By playing to few pro active card you are basically dismissing one of those options which will result into being screwed if:
-You don’t the right answer against the opponent threat
-There is no threat to answer

Valid point. However, the fact that most games end quickly once you get to turn 7 allows you to focus more on survival and less on playing proactive threats. If you run too many threats you run into the issue of not having enough answers. It’s all about finding that balance.

6 7 drops and a bunch of situational answer

There’s Grasp, but I wouldn’t call Lure or Paragon particularly situational. Both are very good removals in almost any situation where a removal is needed.

So your average curve patern is completely messed up and rely exclusively on the fact that you have the right answer at the right time.

The curve does take a hit for not having these strong minions, yes, but at the same time, the removals of the deck help it survive after you reach your 7-core turn.

The 7 Drops are so incredibly powerful that once you get there, you’d play one every turn. Having a deck of more answers is great here because you can react instantly to your opponent’s plays. Reaper and Reaver take a turn to get going which as a result of your tempo loss to Nova or some bad luck in the earlygame could not be enough. Stuff like Sunset Paragon, Kelaino, a spell from Loremaster, or Demonic Lure acts instantly and though it may not be as strong standalone as Reaper or Revenant, happens to be more relevant to the occasions where you need 1-2 turns to draw your finisher.

Continuing from your last two points, removals like Lure and Grasp are more relevant since they can be played earlier, and later with another card in the same turn to gain your a lead on the board. Gaining that lead is very important since it allows you to comfortably play Nova turn 7. Gaining a lead with both Reaper and Reaver also relies on outside RNG to some extent (Reaver less so, but again, not many turns you can play him), which I’d also wish to avoid.

If one does wish to run these cards though, I agree entirely with your distribution of:

2 reaper 2 reaver 3 shadow nova 2 reveneant

because Reaper and Reaver are more situational, and running more minions affords you the ability to run one less Revenant.

You are wrong :slight_smile:

####1 Copy:

No Mulligan no Replace no Draw by turn 5: 28%

2 card Mulligan no Replace no Draw by turn 5: 34%

2 card Mulligan every turn Replace no Draw by turn 5: 49%

2 card Mulligan every turn Replace turn 3 Draw 2 (Sojourner average) by turn 5: 57%

####2 copies:

No Mulligan no Replace no Draw by turn 5: 44%

2 card Mulligan no Replace no Draw by turn 5: 49%

2 card Mulligan every turn Replace no Draw by turn 5: 65%

2 card Mulligan every turn Replace turn 3 Draw 2 (Sojourner average) by turn 5: 80%

Hope I didn’t mess up the math there, but that seems about right. And that’s assuming the rest of your deck is singleton cards, so with replace not being able to get you the card you just replaced, the chance to draw a double or triple goes a lot higher.

There’s no incentive for having a single copy of a card in your deck over having double of another one. Only thing you are gaining is deck space, which honestly isn’t all that needed with Shadow Creep, it’s a very flexible deck since most of its power comes from a few cards.

1 Like

If the meta in heavy on zen’rui then I would rather run zen’rui on my own to get them back if needed than cutting cards that are necessary in my deck.

If you run too many threats you run into the issue of not having enough answers. It’s all about finding that balance.

how is a couple of reaver or reaper too many?

There’s no incentive for having a single copy of a card in your deck over having double of another one. Only thing you are gaining is deck space, which honestly isn’t all that needed with Shadow Creep, it’s a very flexible deck since most of its power comes from a few cards.

Your numbers just say that if you play less exemplar of a card you have less chance to draw it (mind blown). As I said in magic we play a lot of 1 of even without tutor in 60 cards deck. The reason is simply that sometimes you don’t want to draw to many exemplar of a card because it is too situational, if the cards situational AND late game oriented you are likely to draw it if the games goes long and have it for the right moment without polluting your deck with situational cards. 1 of are good especially in Duelyst since the replace give you this constant card selection that help you to hit the right card at the right moment. 1 of sees a lot of play in Magic and Duelyst, and it is going to be more and more the case as the game involve and the card pool as well as the meta diversify. But if you are comfortable denying the accumulated knowledge of thousand of TCG players that dedicated a significant portion of their life playing for more than 20 years that’s your problem.

Your numbers just say that if you play less exemplar of a card you have less chance to draw it (mind blown). As I said in magic we play a lot of 1 of even without tutor in 60 cards deck. The reason is simply that sometimes you don’t want to draw to many exemplar of a card because it is too situational, if the cards situational AND late game oriented you are likely to draw it if the games goes long and have it for the right moment without polluting your deck with situational cards. 1 of are good especially in Duelyst since the replace give you this constant card selection that help you to hit the right card at the right moment. 1 of sees a lot of play in Magic and Duelyst, and it is going to be more and more the case as the game involve and the card pool as well as the meta diversify. But if you are comfortable denying the accumulated knowledge of thousand of TCG players that dedicated a significant portion of their life playing for more than 20 years that’s your problem.

I think you’re missing several very substantial points here. Firstly, playing 1-ofs in Magic: the Gathering is far from the norm - the default has always been to run 4 copies of a card if you always want to draw it and can afford to open with multiples, 3 copies of a card that you want to draw consitently but don’t want to draw multiple copies of and 2 copies of a card that you only really want to draw near the end of the game. You might run less copies of a card because you don’t want to draw into it frequently, but if it’s worth playing whatsoever, it’s worth playing it in numbers that you can reasonably expect to find it - otherwise you might as well replace it with a card that you are happy to draw more copies of. The accumulated knowledge of thousands of TCG players is that 1-ofs are actively looked down upon without strong justifications - it’s very demonstratably incorrect. Every card in your deck should be a core part of your strategy that you want to run 3 copies of unless there’s a good reason to stray from the default.

Now, one of those justications that is fairly valid in Magic: the Gathering is diversifying cards with the same function - rather than running 4 copies of the same removal spell, you might 3 copies and 1-2 copies of a slightly more niche removal spell that still functions well enough when outside of its niche. If you have a deck that has plenty of card filtering, you might choose to run 1-2 copies of several different 3-mana counterspells with an incidental bonus, since the counterspell part is what you care about and the incidental bonus isn’t a substantial loss if you draw a less optimal counterspell (which is less common in Duelyst due to the smaller card pool and there being less functionally equivalent cards). But unlike in Magic: the Gathering, the replace mechanic in Duelyst has a key feature that actually disencourages you from running 1-ofs - you can’t replace a card into another copy of itself. This means that if you draw a card from one category (late-game bomb, early 2-drop minion, removal spell, etc) and you want to replace it for a card in a different category, you have better chances of finding the card you want if the card that you’re replacing away is a 3-of.

Let’s run with the example 3 Revenant and 3 Reaper vs 2 Revenant, 2 Vorpal and 2 Reaper. If you don’t have a Turn 1 two-drop in the first situation and you replace away your Revenant, you can’t draw either of the other two Revenants - you’ve eliminated more possible cards that you don’t want to replace into and you’ve guarunteed that the biggest minion that you can replace into is Reaper, since there isn’t a Vorpal for you to accidentally hit. In the second situation, you can replace Revenant into Vorpal or visa versa - your ability to play on curve is improved if you reduce the diversity of cards at each mana cost and gain more control over what you can’t receive from your replace. The same is true for niche removal spells - if you run 3 Daemonic Lure instead of three different 1-of removal spells, you can guaruntee that you won’t just draw another one of your 1-of removal spells when you’re replacing in search of a minion. Duelyst games also tend to be shorter and somewhat more snowbally than games of Magic: the Gathering, which means that you have less time to find your niche cards and therefore need to run proportionally more copies in order to find them soon enough.

In short, Magic is a different game from Duelyst - games end faster, there are less functionally equivalent cards in Duelyst that serve overlapping functions and the replace mechanic actively encourages you to run full playsets in order to increase the consistency of your deck even further than running full playsets does in Magic. There are definitely niche situations where running 1 copy of a card makes sense in Duelyst and can produce strong results, but it definitely shouldn’t be your default approach - most of the cards in your deck should be the core elements of your strategy that you mentioned in your previous post. As you alluded to when talking about Breath of the Unborn, running niche 1-ofs as tech against multiple different situations is usually less effective than just narrowing down which situations you expect to encounter often and using your slots to tech more heavily against those most likely scenarios.

Sorry if the response was slightly overkill - this just seemed to be several intertwined points that were each worth providing a second viewpoint on.

playing 1-ofs in Magic: the Gathering is far from the norm

You are factually wrong, proof last PT top8:

http://www.mtgtop8.com/event?e=12179&d=269924&f=ST

Every deck (excepted one) plays at least one 1 of in there list Main deck without counting sideboard nor land cards, if you count sideboard there is plenty. This tournament is in standard where the card pool is the smallest among all MTG format if you go on older formats random slots in competitive list are the norm.

Every card in your deck should be a core part of your strategy

False for obvious reason.

rather than running 4 copies of the same removal spell, you might 3 copies and 1-2 copies of a slightly more niche removal spell that still functions well enough when outside of its niche.

This is also true in Duelyst and will become even more obvious as the card pool grow.In fact players already plays 1 of and 2 of regularly, proof: last TW decklist:

As you can see at least half of the list contains random slots and the huge majority have 2 of slots.

you can’t replace a card into another copy of itself.

Oh yeah forgot about that point .

There are definitely niche situations where running 1 copy of a card makes sense in Duelyst and can produce strong results, but it definitely shouldn’t be your default approach

I never said so. Playing 1 of or 2 should not be systematic just like playing 3 of, it depends on the deck.