Duelyst Forums

Buffing Bad cards:

#1

Duelyst has a bit of a history of buffing poor cards instead of letting them fester away in obscurity. With new expansions introducing some power creep, I hope that the poor cards will see some reworks, instead of letting them Magma Rager away (yes, I used “magma Rager” as a verb). I hope that Counterplay has some plan for the slew of universally useless cards in this game.

In conclusion, I would like to thank Counterplay Games for their efforts in making even the least played cards interesting either through periodic reworks, amazing pixel art, or cool, albeit useless, effects. Keep up the good work!

Now, just for fun, here are some reworks that I would make to bad cards.

Sunstone Templar
2 mana
1/3
Whenever this deals damage, add a sun drop elixir to your hand.

Oh how the mighty has fallen! This used to be an insane card back when it had dispel-touch and rush. Now, it does next to nothing compared to the other Lyonar 2 drops and is thouroughly outclassed by ephemeral shroud. My suggestion might make Healing Lyonar better and allow Lyonar players to survive longer.

Mask of Shadows
2 mana
+1 attack, your general cannot be attacked by characters with less attack than them.

Oh how the mighty have fallen! This used to be the best artifact, now it is among the worst. +4 back stab is hardly even an interesting ability, making this not deserving of the legendary status. My rework would make it more in flavour with the stealth aspect, protecting your general and attacking when they see fit, like an assassin.

Orb Weaver
3 mana
2/3
Provoke. Dying wish, return this to your hand and restore 3 health.

Oh how the mighty have… Never mind; this was never good. Orb weaver has recently taken a huge hit with in introduction of the strictly better Pax. My suggestion would make it synergize with Vetruvian dying wish and add some time travel flavour. Also, Vetruvian is currently sitting on a bunch of good artifacts and late game minions but have few heals.

Breath of the Unborn
4 mana
Deal 2 damage to all enemy minions and restore health to all friendly characters equal the the amount of damage dealt.

It is sad to see such an underplayed card get great flavour text. This suggestion would make it much easier for Abyssian decks to catch up from early aggression. Right now, Abyssian only starts to shine around turns 5-9, when they can drop their creep payoff cards or take advantage of deathwatch. Before that, they are stuck with a mediocre earlygame. Something like this would help Abyssian recover from early aggression.

Tremor
3 mana
Deal 3 damage to all minions in a 2*2 area. They may move on their next turn.

Magmar is a bit lacking in 3 cost cards. Something like this would make great small minion removal that can also function as a stalling tool in the late game. Think of this as a Ki Beholder in spell form. This encourages the opponent to spread their minions out, which plays into frenzy.

Wolfraven
3 mana
2/5
Flying. Opening Gambit: Reflect the board about the centre column.

Essentially, this teleports all units on your side of the field to corresponding spaces on the opponents side and vice versa. Units on the centre column are unaffected. I wanted more support for infiltrate and this can easily be used to activate infiltrate. This encourages players to remain near the center of the board to avoid infiltrate. Also combos with Lightning Blitz and Avalanche.

Astral Crusader
4 mana
4/5
Whenever you replace this card, gain 3 health

The current Crusader seems like a miscalculation, like it was printed without crunching some numbers first. Something like this would be playable while not being broken and give some support to replace decks. Also, that Sprite needs a better effect than its current one.

Serpenti
(Rename to Derpenti)
4 Mana
7/4
Frenzy. Also damages nearby friendly minions with its frenzy.

This would make the card much more interesting than just a plain old thorn needled with dire tide frenzy. The opponent might be able to deny good frenzy positions by placing units so that this hits your own units. Something like this would be a ton of fun in gauntlet.

3 Likes
#2

All of these reworks are interesting, but to me these aren’t necessarily reworks, more of re-makes. They are all so much more different now (Other than the spells) and are basically new cards. Take my point with a grain of salt though, I’m just one duelyst player.

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#3

that’s what a rework is lol, it’s another word for remaking the card

#4

For me, at least, a rework is when you try and make something into something stronger/weaker while still retaining its play-style. That’s why it’s confusing to me when someone says it’s a rework but changes it into something different.

#5

That is one of my favourite things about Duelyst; when the developers rework a card, the don’t just tinker with the stats or cost, then try to shape it into something new and exciting. Look at Lantern Fox and the Shadow Creep mechanic.

Some cards that I have listed here (Mask of Shadows, Astral Crusader [especially]) are quantitatively broken. It is possible to mathematically prove that Astral Crusader is utter garbage. It just doesn’t make sense. There must have been some oversight in the mathematics department since the effect is just… no. Mechanics like these should probably be entirely redone.

#6

Mesmerize cantrips. :open_mouth:

I’ve thought about doing a monthly “buff this card” thread like we do for card nerfs, but I don’t have enough interest. Someone else should do it.

2 Likes
#7

Fun fact: Orb weaver would have synergized with Sajj’s original BBS, which was ‘return a friendly minion to your hand and give it +1/+1’. The devs changed it because it was broken with mechs. However, you can still see this interaction with Kara’s BBS with Zenrui and hailstone prison.

#8

that’s balancing, nerfing or buffing. Rework means a complete rehaul.

#9

Oh my God…

I really understand your desire, and I am sympathetic, but you’ll be ruining most of my decks with these changes :stuck_out_tongue:

EDIT: it’s actually not that bad, at first glance I saw 3 of the 4 first ones ruining decks I have, but those appear to be the only ones :stuck_out_tongue:

Let’s go over them:

Sunstone Templar: run 3 copies in one of my Lyonar decks, I didn’t know about its history, but it’s still very nice and does the job of drawing removal out of people’s hands and/or keeping the general close. In a deck which relies on sticky minions it’s preferred by me over the other Lyonar 2-drops (though I might run 2 windblades alongside it, don’t recall exactly).

So basically: I like it like this! (never knew a different version, that helps a lot)

Mask of Shadows: I actually tried to make a deck around this with Mist Walking, but meh… Quite situational. I don’t even remember how it played, it wasn’t a long-lived deck, so I wouldn’t really oppose to this. Still, I do think the artifact as it is now creates potential if there would be other cards which comboed well with it. In fact, I think after typing this I’ll try a deck with it again just to see :slight_smile:

Orb Weaver: I actually have a largely successful Vetruvian deck with Portal Guardian, and this thing, especially since it triggers on your own turn, can cause nice surprises for the opponent. It isn’t bad. And changing it would really hamper my deck :stuck_out_tongue:

Breath of the Unborn: You are actually nerfing it… Unless you mean: Add health point according to damage dealt, in which case it would be OP.
This card is just really good as is, and is in various Abyssian decks I use. Just set up more Deepfire Devourers, Black Soli (Soluses), Klaxons, and Abyssal Juggernauts in your decks if you want it to be good. It’s already really good imo.

Tremor: I tried it out, and it is quite situational… I would indeed like to see this reworked. The game is too fast-paced for not-killing-but-delaying opposing minions. It wouldn’t even be OP if it were battlefield-wide instead of 2x2 (with its Original effect!).

Wolfraven: We already have Lightning to flip sides and Avalanche to punish… I also do not see anything wrong with it. Sure, it’s not often played, but it’s not bad. Maybe make it a Vespyr :stuck_out_tongue: But honestly, not a real problem imo this card.

Astral Crusader: Love the art, love the idea behind it, put it in a lot of decks in my first week, it actually worked once and it wasn’t helpful the one time it did. Thing is StormMetal Golem is better, period.
So yes, agree on a rework of some kind.

Serpenti: I dunno, I do not really think this needs fixing. It’s good enough as is imo. Granted, I don’t really have it in decks anymore, but we cannot have every card in decks anyway :wink:

Now of course, the devs shouldn’t take into account my personal decks, but I would like it if they take into account the variety and width of possibilties and options for deckbuilding.

#10

Isn’t there a bit of group think going on with why you do not see some of these?

Sunstone templar is actually just a fine two drop in a faction that already has a great two drop. Still, he is good at captuiring tiles early on, pretty resilient at 4 life and his dispels are situational, but not bad by any stretch. This card is hilarious against Vaath. Your rework seems a bit too good to me. It is even more resilient, and getting 10 life of your two drop might be bit too much.

Orb Weaver: I think this card still has a reason to exist. It allows for long distance deploying, and you are still getting 4 life and 4 damage our of a three drop. The card would be silly if it cost 2 or if the weavers had better stats. It is not comparable to pax by the way. Being a battle pet and costing two makes it a very different card;

The others on the list are pretty situational or just missing one keyword. Astral crusader would be great if it had a keyword. He is not bad as is anyways, just very unreliable and not really exciting. I think the card comes too late and has too little impact. The cost reduction does not look like it would matter all too frequently. Now, if he had any keyword like provoke, frenzy, flying or some of the better keywords like rush…

#11

Here’s the one topping my list:

Windstorm Obelysk
Vetruvian, Structure
3 Mana / 0 Attack / 6 Health
Summon Dervish. Your Dervishes may move an additional space.

The extra Health is usually more of a liability than a benefit because you want to be able to suicide your Wind Dervishes into things: 3 Health makes them too survivable, clogging up your board, disallowing you to pile everything you have onto the threat you’re trying to take out. With this effect, Windstorm Obelysk might actually be worth playing because it complements their play style. Even the name makes sense this way.

1 Like
#12

This is also what I would like to see for Windstorm Obelisk. +1 movement is a great feature for Dervishes to have.

#13

I think the Abyssian Wraithlings Swarm strategy could also use a buff like this. Make Wraithlings move one additional space. Heck, it could be a rework for Blood Baronette or a new card depending on how you guys view BBaronette.
Also, I wonder if a spell card that allows you to destroy all of your Wraithlings & resummon them at the end of your opponent would be viable since it allows you to dodge something akin to blistering skorn.

#14

They used to be like that, it was better that way too, no idea why it was changed, but oh well.

1 Like
#15

I don’t know for sure but I assume it was reworked in anticipation of when Zirix would have his Rush Dervish BBS. It would have been so broken then.

1 Like
#16

I did not know that, and that makes some sense! With Zirix’s BBS in its current state maybe it’s time for CP to consider changing this card back then.

#17

astral crusader should just be 10 mana that says whenever u replace “astral crusader” so it would worth playing 3… we are normally dead by turn 6 in the meta so just make the card faster

#18