A request for CPG: Please make Zirix's BBS place-able


#1

Hey everyone, A quick introduction here, my ign is TheMagma and I have been playing this game since March. I don’t often comment or make posts, etc. but this is a topic that I feel very strongly on

The Rng nature of Zirix’s BBS has come up before in the past and I’m aware of the answers CPG gave as to why Zirix’s BBS remains Rng based. But the justification received simply just doesn’t feel good enough!

I feel that having control over being able to place the poop dervish would be a massive improvement not only to strategic elements of the game but also to the enjoyment of using Zirix. I don’t know how many times I’ve spawned a poop dervish and have had it land in range of faie’s warbird only to feel like an absolute idiot for simply trying to take advantage of the bbs; same thing goes for trying to play around makantor and holy immolaton, the fact that in these circumstances its almost better just to not take advantage of the bbs feels very defeating and very frustrating especially when having control over positioning would allow players the chance to still play around all of those effects and more.

The strategic positional reasons as to why the bbs should be place-able are all very obvious - using the dervish to block passage to mana tiles, positioning it to steal a mana tile in order ramp; using it for general body blocking; using it to set up for 3rd wish lethals/plays; or at the very very least saving it as a body to trade to control board, etc.

plus it makes dervish support cards like the current iteration of third wish much more reliable and consistent in their usage allowing for more dynamic and interesting lines of play rather than as it currently exists: “hooray it spawned in line with my general and now its gonna die to warbird while i eat more dmg this is fun :smiley: RNG is great”!

A large part of enjoying the game I believe comes from being able to employ and carry out strategies and specific lines of play that the player has direct control over.

as it stands now the bbs Rng does not make the game more fun and dynamic but rather just more frustrating; its very obvious that Bloodborn Spells are an integral aspect to how the game is played and proper usage is very important in finding success and is an element that i feel players should have control over - Reva as we all know has this exact element of control and can utilize positioning to either set up for a buff spell next turn or to simply create a distraction to warp the opponents play and positioning.

This is a very simple wishlist request and It feels like there is no reason as to why players shouldn’t have control over this bbs spawn. This is a change I would love to see. So please CPG, i ask, nay I beg please for the love/hate of Rngesus please make the BBS spawn be place-able. Thanks for reading everyone, I know the post is long. see you all out there on the battlegrounds!


#2

CPG already addressed this. They said something among the lines of:

“In testing it was proven how the positioning of the devrish didn’t impact the outcomes of the games much. It also might be too complicated for new players. We don’t want them to stress over where to place it so we made it random so they don’t have to make the decision.”

No, I am not joking. If you want source I believe you can find it in the post BBS patch roundtable VOD or in the comment section of the reddit thread of the said VOD.

Yes, I also believe that to be bullcrap. They probably just forgot about it after they changed it from the version that had rush. However, considering the Vet’s current power level, I say let it be. No need to make Sajj fall into obscurity once again.


#3

I think that the randomness is supposed to make it weaker… because dervish synergy, so it’s too strong otherwise?

Personally I don’t agree with that, but I felt it worth mentioning…

And against warbird, that’s literally ONE general out of the total 12… and so I think it’s not relevant…

Wouldn’t mind seeing it controllable, would be nice.


#4

That’s exactly the responses i refer to in my post and I really believe that to be a lot of nonsense lol Vet is strong right now absolutely, and that’s nice but I don’t think having that control would really push Zirix over the edge. I know its not a huge deal and its not something that is in dire need of repair but its a change I think for the better. Plus this month I played mostly Sajj to S - had a lot of fun with her and I think she would still be a playable option regardless!


#5

yeah I realize; i over exaggerated the warbird interaction to really stress my point, but even still being able to utilize proper positioning would mean i could prevent Kara from killing it with maw, warbird, makantor, holy immolation, etc. my main issue being is that I think there is just no reason why we shouldn’t be able to!


#6

Here’s an Idea: what about summoning on a random Space adjacent to the Enemy general? That would be more interesting than just a plain old 2/2.


#7

I mean that would definitely be an interesting concept especially since it would be super annoying for the opponent to deal with, it would be easier to force the spawn and it restricts mobility. Very neat idea I like it! :slight_smile:


#8

Also could function as an easy way to throw a fattie next to their face, like airdrop.

Downside: dies instantly, harder to 3rd wish effectively


#9

if zirix gets his BBS placeable, then lilithe gets her BBS placeable. i understand why reva gets hers placeable, since range minions are useless on the frontlines and there is no synergy of having it die or any super health buffs available.


#10

Placing your “zoo” minions isn’t as necessary.

Why not just swap Sajj and Zirix’s BBS so the newbie thing isn’t a factor?


#11

This falls firmly into the ‘unnecessary rng’ category so I’m all for changing it.


#12

The newbie thing is only a bad excuse anyways. It’s a game that promotes itself to be ‘tactical positioning based combat’ or sth along these lines. New Players have to make decision on where to summon their minions all the time by nature of the game, and they almost always misplace them. That’s something you learn while playing the game. They also can’t blame it on the ‘Interface logic’ since the new players don’t have to click on the BBS button alone anyways, but even now have to make a second interaction.

But lets be real, all that placement stuff confuses me beyond limit, can we just make summoning happen on a random space around your general so that i don’t have to think please?


#13

Vetruvian’s current power level should not be a factor in these sorts of design decisions anyway. The reasons why Vetruvian is currently strong to overpowered can be summed up in four cards: Kron, Nimbus, Falcius and Pax. And rebalancing to change its power levels, if deemed necessary, should only affect some or all of those cards.
Meanwhile, it’s plain for everyone to see that Counterplay’s original argument for having RNG falls flat in this particular case. There is absolutely no reason why placing a Reeva minion should be more ‘challenging’ or ‘more work’ for a new player than placing a Zirix dervish. And quite honestly, it DOES impact the outcame of games. I can think of at least two games in my last 50 where I directly lost or won the game because of the way the Zirix RNG turned out and allowed or did not allow my opponent to deploy a Rush minion / avoid a Provoke minion etc. It’s a small percentage, sure, but there’s zero reason why it should be there in the first place.


#14

counterplay’s arguement that the placement of the iron dervish wouldnt really matter is complete bullshit and i am very upset about it

the argument for the new players is also dumb, they have to place their minions every single turn, why would zirix bbs be a problem?

their explanation is just lazy and dumb


#15

So just out of curiosity, would you be okay with Lilithe’s BBS also being placeable instead of random? I mean there are two bodies but it’s still 2/2. Since as it stands the only one who gets to place is Reva with the 1/1.


#16

Lilithe is an interesting case because of the way she wants to use those wraithlings, mainly as fodder to trigger her deathwatch abilities or removal cards or even for deathfire sacrifice. Plus with two bodies spawning its easier to force the spawns you want and say for example you have a priestess or shadowdancer up, you don’t really care where it spawns because they are still going to pressure you hard. To some extent it matters to me where Zirix’s spawn because I only get one body, and I have nothing to gain off having it instantly die in most cases and I may have a specific usage of that body in mind.


#17

The main reason it is random is for consistency and theme. All the Obelisks are random placement, so allowing Zirix to place his would be out of theme. And it is undeniably less clicks to just “push button, get Dervish” which can be a valid concern for new players (analysis paralysis)

I realize we are all experts here and these reasons may seem like “bullshit” but theme, consistency and ease of understanding are all things that designers are very passionate about.


#18

It isn’t less buttons. Zirix BBS as it is now also needs 2 clicks.


#19

i dont think its bad really:

-a 2/2 is actually hard to remove than an 1/1. So it could be used just for blocking, while reva´s would be pointless most of the time.

-They are dervishes. While right now there are only but a few cards that interact with them, there might be more in the future, that would give them direct sinergy. The other guys that have direct sinergy with some cards are wrathlings, they are also positioned randomly. Reva´s heartseeker dont have this: there are no cards that read “give your heartseekers” or faction cards that give something specific to ranged minions.

-Songhai is not a minion oriented faction, they rely more on spells, so in order to make them “stronger”, you choose where to place them. Zirix IS minion oriented, they rely on them mostly, so that they could spam guys every turn, these need a balance factor: in this case, random positioning. Same goes for lilithe.


#20

You would need to click the BBS, click the board, then click to place it (like with reva)

So it is one click less, but I feel like that is kinda trivial.